Mycenaean Saga

C. The text states: “ Pelops kills him and as he dies, Myrtilus calls a curse down upon the family of pelops. This curse passes pelops who dies a natural death as does his wife, both of whom where buried in separate spaces near to one another within the altis walls at the site of Olympia. Pelops establishes the Olympic games as well as the city of Olympia in memorial tribute to the valor of oinomaius. These games founded in the late bronze age were not recorded officialy until 776 BC.”
Im not sure I understand. How could pelops create these games when he is dead? Or where they inspired by him? Or is this just stating something that happened before his death?

E. I really enjoyed the “ Mid points” section of this paper. It was really interesting to see the orgins of Menelaus and Agamemnon. I did not know they were brothers. I also found it very cool to see how all these different stories piece together. Every single detail stated in here is necessary to spark the Trojan war.

G. If I were Thyestes I would feel like a total looser. First I get the bad effects of the curse, not my brother, and I go crazy and try to kill his wife. Then my brother gets mad at me, and slaughters my children. Then to make things even worse, he cooks them up, invites me over to dinner and has me eat them! I mean come on! Then I go mad and “wander aimlessly through Greece” until I find a lover. Who sickeningly enough turns out to be my daughter. Anyways we have a kid who doesn’t really to much to help the story, besides fall in love with agamemnons wife

B. Towards the end of the passage where Agamemnon shot the deer to feed his troops, the goddess of nature Artemis refused to allow winds to blow because the deer was sacred to her and because of this the warriors couldn’t sail to the invasion point, Troy. I feel like this relates to how there can be good and bad karma, sometimes it is deserved and sometimes it’s not and that’s just the way life is. I feel this way because earlier in the passage, Pelops who was supposed to be cursed somehow dodges it and leaves two brothers with it causing one brother (Thyestes) to kill his brother’s (Atreus’) children. This was a curse they both didn’t deserve and unfortunately they had to deal with it and its negative effects.

C. What confused was how numerous characters were mentioned throughout the story, most of the time one after another and this threw me off sometimes because I would get confused as to which character I was reading about or sometimes I would mix them up.

F. At the beginning of their relationship, Pelops (son of Tantalus) and Myrtilus (the charioteer for the king) both trust each other and this is shown when Pelops influences him to substitute a wax pin for a normal axle pin which eventually melts killing Oinomaius and as a result, Pelops wins the battle. After Myrtilus presents Pelops with this deed, Myrtilus asks for his rewards causing Pelops to become angry at him and kill him completely ruining their relationship. Even though Myrtilus isn’t there physically, he places a curse the family of Pelops and their relationship remains poor and destroyed and continues to show how negative it is through other ways such as the curse.

C. I found many passages from these stories very confusing. I felt like once I began reading, I just had so many names thrown out at me, I had no clue what was going on. What was the point of naming the characters nicknames in the beginning of the story? I would have been interested in finding out why that was their nicknames but there was no further explanation of these names. Also, why is Thyestes cursed? Who gave him this curse and why? "Thyestes has several children as well, but as the first victim of the curse, is possessed by a base desire to attack Aerope." If Thyestes knew Atreus wanted to punish him, why would he eat dinner with him or give him his children?
E. "Iphigenia obediently and faithfully arrived at Aulis where in front of all, Agamemnon beheaded her." I found this action both sad and amusing. It was amusing because it shows how savage Agamemnon really is and how he would do anything to make up for the sacred deer he shot. It was sad because he really didn't have to kill Iphigenia, and in such a fatal way. he could have sacrificed another animal without taking the life of an innocent person.
I.@richter and wagner. I agree with richter saying that Thyestes marrying Pelopia was messed up and disturbing. But to take it to the point in which they have kids is just absolutely insane. I also agree with Wagner saying that he was confused when the author gave him so many names in the beginning that it became very overwhelming trying to stay with the story. I would also like to add that it was very confusing when the author wrote down all the family trees that came about.

D- In the Mycenaean Saga Mid Points--says “Punishment for this heinous act, Atreus decapitates the two children of his brother and serves them up to him at a dining table…..” (4-5).This line really shows that what Thyestes did was very wrong and was clearly not acceptable in his brother’s view. I enjoyed this line because I found it humorous on one hand and actually really clever on the other. I think that it was funny because it is unbelievable when you read that the brother of Thyestes could kill his niece and nephew and then cook them and serve them as dinner for his brother. It is also clever because rather than just killing his brother’s kids Atreus comes up with a way to permanently punish brother and also ruin his life. This leads me to believe that Atreus had an ongoing hatred or grudge towards his brother.

E- Mycenaean Saga Mid Points--says “Agamemnon was compelled to feed the large assembly of warriors who he had gathered at Aulis. He shot a deer which was consumed by his troops, but the deer was sacred to the goddess of nature, Artemis who refused to allow winds to come up and escort the ships of Agamemnon across the Aegean Sea to the invasion point, Troy. Told by the priest Chalcis that he had to make a sacrifice of equal magnitude, Agamemnon sent messages to his wife Clytemnestra in which he stated that the Greek warrior Achilles wanted to marry Iphigenia before he went to Troy. Iphigenia obediently and faithfully arrived at Aulis where in front of all Agamemnon beheaded her.” (41-48). After reading this line I was shocked at how twisted Agamemnon was for killing an innocent girl just to make himself even with the goddess of nature, so he could travel to Troy to kill more people. From this Agamemnon seems a bit unstable, very selfish, and in some ways evil. I think these things based on his actions in the quote above. He is unstable because no one in their right mind would sacrifice an innocent girl to equal the killing of an animal. Also because he did this just so he could travel to Troy for war making him selfish. Finally he is evil because he lied to his wife and the girl just to kill her.

G- Mycenaean Saga Mid Points—If I were Thyestes and I had found out that my own brother had killed my children, then cooked them and fed them to me I would have definitely gone insane and flea the area forever. I also would have never forgotten what my brother did and would have definitely done what he did in response to the actions.

B. Without the “beginnings” part, which tells us the names and goes all the way back to Pelops and Oinomaius, I would not have understand the departure and expedition to Troy. The beginning part gave me a whole back story, and I thought it was really interesting seeing how far back the family goes and everything that happens before and leads up to Paris and Helen.


C. What ever happens to the expedition toTroy? Do they ever catch Paris? It kind of leaves us at a cliffhanger, maybe for us to give our own endings. I think what happens is that Agamemnon and Menelaus eventually do find Paris and Helen but don’t kill Paris. They don't kill Paris because Helen says that she was not kidnapped that she chose to go because she fell in love with Paris. I think they kill her instead because of her being unfaithful and foolish. And because of the death of Helen, Paris kills himself as well because he is lonely without Paris.



E. I was shocked when reading what Atreus does to his brother in response to him attacking his wife. I understand that you should never do that to another mans wife, especially his brothers but as said in the text Thyestes was under the curse (Paragraph 2 Line 3) that was put on his family, so really it wasn't his fault. I also thought it was very cruel what Atreus did. During the Mycenaean time they were very violent and murders weren't taken as harshly as they are now but feeding his dead children to him is way over the top.

C. The Beginning of the story was easy to follow. It wasn’t confusing then. But when it got to the midpoint and un-civil like brother act, the names started to come out at you and it was extremely hard to follow. It was especially confusing when it started to talk about the gods and the golden apple. What was that about anyway? Why did that whole paragraph even mean? Why was that paragraph necessary to the other parts of the Saga? These are some questions I have. I have some other questions about the whole issue with Artemis and Iphigenia. Why was the deer equal to the daughter? What did that signify?
F. I see that the relationship between the brothers Atreus and Thyestes is a very harsh but unique relationship. I say this because if a curse was not put down onto the family by Myrtilus, then Thyestes’s children would not have died. Also that means that Thyestes might never have met Pelopia. The only reason for this horrible and gruesome act was because of the curse. So I don’t think that deep down inside the brothers, without the curse, they would not have done that to each other.
H. Pelops is a young man. He is quite muscular and a little skinny. He is wearing a tank top and shorts with sandals. His hair is brown with a messy wavy style. He is standing in the middle of a ring. The ring is the race he is about to enter. The ring is large in size. It seems to be about 100 meters in width and 200 meters in length.